P>Music, welcome to a conversation with history. I'm Harry Kreisler of the Institute of International Studies. Our guest today is George Packer, who is a staff writer for The New Yorker and the author of many books, most recently "The Unwinding," which won the National Book Award for nonfiction. He is on the Berkeley campus as the 2017 Jefferson lecturer. George, welcome back to our program. Good to be with you again, Harry. Last time you were here, we talked about "The Unwinding," and when I asked you what you learned from doing that research and writing that book about where America was, that book has been cited as a primer on Trump's America. Trump's victory...I think I have to reject that a little. I didn't imagine Donald Trump's presidency. I believed the polls last year. I thought Hillary would win because the polls said she would. But the book did survey a landscape that was preparing the way for Trump. So, Trumpism, the feelings, the impulses that we call populism that fueled the support that drove him, you know, to victory in the Republican primary, the victory in the general election, was all there in the places I was reporting on five, six, seven years earlier. So, I wasn't...I was, I guess, shocked but not surprised by his victory because that work had prepared me for something like that. I just didn't think we were quite that far gone. And what were some of the things that you found? I mean, you were going to different parts of the country, talking to different people of different social class, and there were some common themes. I mean, as people responded to the 2008 crash...yeah, that was the context for my reporting, was the financial crisis and the Great Recession, the...
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